[ROVERNET - UK] Re: IOE Pistons:
Dermot Harvey
roverman2 at verizon.net
Fri Jan 18 02:41:01 GMT 2008
Hi Linus,
If you decide to rebuild your IOE engine, I may be able to help you
with new pistons - I have a bunch of them. Some don't have part
numbers, but they could be matched up.
Dermot Harvey
Spectral Kinetics
On Jan 17, 2008, at 11:10 AM, rovernet-request at lyris.ccdata.com wrote:
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> [ROVERNET-UK]
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: engine rebuilder suggestions (Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton)
> 2. R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500 (Ruotolo Gianluca (MERCATO STAFF))
> 3. Re: R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500 (Kent Kinard)
> 4. R: R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500 (Ruotolo Gianluca (MERCATO STAFF))
> 5. Getting IOE blocks properly machined (Kent Kinard)
> 6. Re: engine rebuilder suggestions (phing)
> 7. Re: Getting IOE blocks properly machined (phing)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 19:56:46 -0800
> From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" <smokeandsteam at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] engine rebuilder suggestions
> To: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Message-ID:
> <204ec4390801161956n5cd5c7a2ifc7cdb3ae952c9ad at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Linus
>
> I have a feeling that most IOE rebuilds in recent memory have owed
> more to home gargae ingenuity than paid workmen. at least on this side
> of the water
>
> I would talk to West Coast British in Livermore; they will at least
> recognise the engine for what it is which is more than most places can
> say.
>
> http://www.offroadexperience.com/wcb/index.html
>
> Aidrian
>
>>
>> Do any of you have suggestions for a person experienced with this
>> type of engine? Hopefully in California somewhere? It is currently
>> at the land rover engine rebulider, but he has never done one and
>> is taking forever just to tell us what we need to buy. Its been
>> there at least six months without having even been dismantled.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:30:18 +0100
> From: "Ruotolo Gianluca (MERCATO STAFF)" <gianluca.ruotolo at enel.it>
> Subject: R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500
> To: <rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com>
> Message-ID:
> <A1C0D52A24E03A42B49B03C46AA6AD200D6392 at E30IYLM1.risorse.enel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Auction has expired, is there a permanent link with the photos?
>
> Bes regards, gianluca.
>
> -----Messaggio originale-----
> Da: rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com
> [mailto:rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com] Per conto di Kent Kinard
> Inviato: sabato 12 gennaio 2008 15.09
> A: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Oggetto: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500
>
>
> Hi Glen,
> I have some other pictures of this car if anyone is interested. They
> were made before the car was moved into Tom's warehouse. The spares
> include a new set of rear spring rubber bushes which by themselves are
> about $250. I talked to him last year about the car, but it is
> just too
>
> far for me to go get it and it isn't any better than the one I have.
>
> Roverly,
> Kent K.
>
> Glen Wilson wrote:
>>
>> 1967 Rover Saloon - $1500
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -
>> --
>> http://sacramento.craigslist.org/car/528760448.html
>>
>> Reply to: sale-528760448 at craigslist.org
>>
> <mailto:sale-528760448 at craigslist.org?subject=1967%20Rover%20Saloon%
> 20-%
> 20$1500>
>>
>> Date: 2008-01-04, 6:15PM PST
>>
>>
>> 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Saloon 4 door Coupe. Aluminum ex-Buick V8,
>> automatic, power steering, leather, bucket seats, sunroof and RHD.
>> The
>> trunk is packed full of extra parts and manuals. Great restoration
>> candidate. $1500.00. Please call for more photos or details. Thanks,
>> Tom 209.402.5949. European Sports Car British.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
>> instructions:
>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> rovernet mailing list
> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 06:09:29 -0600
> From: Kent Kinard <kentkinard at verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500
> To: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Message-ID: <478F4579.6070802 at verizon.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi Gianluca,
> I'm not sure of another site, but I do have some pictures, if I can
> find
> them.
> I understand the car has been sold.
>
> Roverly,
> Kent K.
>
> Ruotolo Gianluca (MERCATO STAFF) wrote:
>> Auction has expired, is there a permanent link with the photos?
>>
>> Bes regards, gianluca.
>>
>> -----Messaggio originale-----
>> Da: rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com
>> [mailto:rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com] Per conto di Kent Kinard
>> Inviato: sabato 12 gennaio 2008 15.09
>> A: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> Oggetto: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
>> $1,500
>>
>>
>> Hi Glen,
>> I have some other pictures of this car if anyone is interested. They
>> were made before the car was moved into Tom's warehouse. The spares
>> include a new set of rear spring rubber bushes which by themselves
>> are
>> about $250. I talked to him last year about the car, but it is
>> just too
>>
>> far for me to go get it and it isn't any better than the one I have.
>>
>> Roverly,
>> Kent K.
>>
>> Glen Wilson wrote:
>>
>>> 1967 Rover Saloon - $1500
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> --
>>> --
>>> http://sacramento.craigslist.org/car/528760448.html
>>>
>>> Reply to: sale-528760448 at craigslist.org
>>>
>>>
>> <mailto:sale-528760448 at craigslist.org?subject=1967%20Rover%20Saloon
>> %20-%
>> 20$1500>
>>
>>> Date: 2008-01-04, 6:15PM PST
>>>
>>>
>>> 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Saloon 4 door Coupe. Aluminum ex-Buick V8,
>>> automatic, power steering, leather, bucket seats, sunroof and
>>> RHD. The
>>> trunk is packed full of extra parts and manuals. Great restoration
>>> candidate. $1500.00. Please call for more photos or details. Thanks,
>>> Tom 209.402.5949. European Sports Car British.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> rovernet mailing list
>>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
>>> instructions:
>>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>>> Back-up list and photos at:
>>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
>> instructions:
>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and
>> follow instructions:
>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:10:48 +0100
> From: "Ruotolo Gianluca (MERCATO STAFF)" <gianluca.ruotolo at enel.it>
> Subject: R: R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
> $1,500
> To: <rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com>
> Message-ID:
> <A1C0D52A24E03A42B49B03C46AA6AD200D6394 at E30IYLM1.risorse.enel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Dear Kent,
>
> thanks in advancefor the picture.
> I' ve got a lot of cars, and, sincerely, I only wanted to have a
> look and did not want to buy it.
>
> Best regards, Gianluca.
>
> -----Messaggio originale-----
> Da: rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com [mailto:rovernet-
> bounces at lyris.ccdata.com] Per conto di Kent Kinard
> Inviato: giovedì 17 gennaio 2008 13.09
> A: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Oggetto: Re: R: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock,
> CA $1,500
>
>
> Hi Gianluca,
> I'm not sure of another site, but I do have some pictures, if I can
> find
> them.
> I understand the car has been sold.
>
> Roverly,
> Kent K.
>
> Ruotolo Gianluca (MERCATO STAFF) wrote:
>> Auction has expired, is there a permanent link with the photos?
>>
>> Bes regards, gianluca.
>>
>> -----Messaggio originale-----
>> Da: rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com
>> [mailto:rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com] Per conto di Kent Kinard
>> Inviato: sabato 12 gennaio 2008 15.09
>> A: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> Oggetto: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Coupe Turlock, CA
>> $1,500
>>
>>
>> Hi Glen,
>> I have some other pictures of this car if anyone is interested. They
>> were made before the car was moved into Tom's warehouse. The spares
>> include a new set of rear spring rubber bushes which by themselves
>> are
>> about $250. I talked to him last year about the car, but it is
>> just too
>>
>> far for me to go get it and it isn't any better than the one I have.
>>
>> Roverly,
>> Kent K.
>>
>> Glen Wilson wrote:
>>
>>> 1967 Rover Saloon - $1500
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> -
>>> -
>>> --
>>> http://sacramento.craigslist.org/car/528760448.html
>>>
>>> Reply to: sale-528760448 at craigslist.org
>>>
>>>
>> <mailto:sale-528760448 at craigslist.org?subject=1967%20Rover%20Saloon
>> %20
>> -%
>> 20$1500>
>>
>>> Date: 2008-01-04, 6:15PM PST
>>>
>>>
>>> 1967 Rover 3.5 Liter Saloon 4 door Coupe. Aluminum ex-Buick V8,
>>> automatic, power steering, leather, bucket seats, sunroof and RHD.
>>> The trunk is packed full of extra parts and manuals. Great
>>> restoration candidate. $1500.00. Please call for more photos or
>>> details. Thanks, Tom 209.402.5949. European Sports Car British.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> rovernet mailing list
>>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
>>> instructions: http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>>> Back-up list and photos at:
>>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
>> instructions: http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and follow
>> instructions: http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> rovernet mailing list
> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and
> follow instructions: http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/
> rovernet
> Back-up list and photos at: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/
> Rover_net/
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 09:25:58 -0600
> From: Kent Kinard <kentkinard at verizon.net>
> Subject: [ROVERNET - UK] Getting IOE blocks properly machined
> To: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Message-ID: <478F7386.3020307 at verizon.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi Linus,
> About rebuilds. My old machinist in San Antonio has rebuilt several
> Land Rover IOE's. We had a conversation several years ago about the
> lack of IOE style torque plates in the US. He felt that they were no
> longer as important for the rebuild of these engines because modern
> machining methods use the crankshaft centerline as the data point.
> I am
> still of the opinion that the availability of an IOE style torque
> plate
> is important to an IOE rebuild. If, at some point, a rebore and new
> pistons do become necessary, you may want to explore these issues.
> Most of us saloon owners are happy if our IOE's don't have a death
> rattle. Land Rover owners faced with the necessity of reliable
> performance in the middle of nowhere have to take these issues much
> more
> seriously. Cost of IOE rebuilds is very high and many LR owners in
> the
> US would rather swap to a domestic engine than do a rebuild.
>
>
> Roverly,
> Kent K.
>
>
> Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton wrote:
>> Linus
>>
>> I have a feeling that most IOE rebuilds in recent memory have owed
>> more to home gargae ingenuity than paid workmen. at least on this
>> side
>> of the water
>>
>> I would talk to West Coast British in Livermore; they will at least
>> recognise the engine for what it is which is more than most places
>> can
>> say.
>>
>> http://www.offroadexperience.com/wcb/index.html
>>
>> Aidrian
>>
>>
>>> Do any of you have suggestions for a person experienced with this
>>> type of engine? Hopefully in California somewhere? It is
>>> currently at the land rover engine rebulider, but he has never
>>> done one and is taking forever just to tell us what we need to
>>> buy. Its been there at least six months without having even been
>>> dismantled.
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and
>> follow instructions:
>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 10:58:34 -0500
> From: phing <phing at videotron.ca>
> Subject: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] engine rebuilder suggestions
> To: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Message-ID: <003101c85921$d0a49920$3f558342 at userbeb5651830>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=original
>
> Linus
> I would suggest you buy a shop manual and parts list on E Bay and
> do it yourself . I have rebuilt Rover P2 , Series 1 LR and Rover
> P3 engines , the granddaddy of your engine at home, with no
> problems .I'm not a mechanic , just an old fart with a likiing for odd
> old cars, a set of tools and a limited toy budget
> These engines are really pretty basic , they need
> blacksmithing , rather than brain surgery ;they were built on steam
> locomotive lines .Why pay some one $$$s per hour to learn about IOE
> engines at your expense and waste paid hours finding out where
> to buy parts ?? . You can always buy the parts yourself and
> subcontract the difficult bits , valve guide replacement , head
> machining etc . I think that Rover had progressed to UNF/ UNC
> threads by the time the 110 engine was built , so you wouldn't even
> need a set of BSF wrenches
> You will need :gallons of penetrating oil and degreaser , a
> gasket set , , new inlet valve guides and seals , valve springs ,
> refurbished rocker shaft [ I found a guy in California who
> specialises in British rocker shaft restoration , at good prices .]
> you
> may possibly need exhaust valves and guides . The state of the
> bores will decide if you need a rebore , pistons and rings . If the
> bores are OK the pistons can be remachined to take new rings, or
> there is a company in Australia which specialises in making new
> pistons for old machinery .If your block has the angled head face
> you may have problems finding a shop with a boring jig to
> accommodate the slope.You should have the head machined as a matter
> of course ,my P3 engine had a 12 thou bow from end to end
> Rover IOE camshafts tend to wear , but the 110 engine had roller
> followers which were supposed to solve this problem . I have not
> found a Rover engine with significant wear in camshaft
> bearings ,oil pump , or main bearings [ even in a high mileage P2
> with no
> oil filtration. the LR and P3 with by pass filtration]. I have
> replaced big ends as a routine procedure. Based on my experience
> You probably won't need a crank regrind . You should replace the
> clutch and check the release bearing while the engine is out of the
> car . Your LR will have a sensible Borg and Beck unit rather than
> the earlier " special " Rover clutch which needs to be set up by
> a brain surgeon . You should also strip and check the water pump ,
> mine started to leak , after I had the engine back in place !
> I used local shops for my machining etc . no one had seen an IOE
> engine , they were all intrigued and happy to contribute their
> expertise at reasonable cost . There's lots of help available on
> the web , so go to it .
> Cheers
> Patrick
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" <smokeandsteam at gmail.com>
> To: <rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 10:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] engine rebuilder suggestions
>
>
>> Linus
>>
>> I have a feeling that most IOE rebuilds in recent memory have owed
>> more to home gargae ingenuity than paid workmen. at least on this
>> side
>> of the water
>>
>> I would talk to West Coast British in Livermore; they will at least
>> recognise the engine for what it is which is more than most places
>> can
>> say.
>>
>> http://www.offroadexperience.com/wcb/index.html
>>
>> Aidrian
>>
>>>
>>> Do any of you have suggestions for a person experienced with this
>>> type of engine? Hopefully in California somewhere? It is
>>> currently at the land rover engine rebulider, but he has never
>>> done one and is taking forever just to tell us what we need to
>>> buy. Its been there at least six months without having even been
>>> dismantled.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and
>> follow instructions:
>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>>
>> --
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.6/1229 - Release Date:
>> 1/17/2008 11:12 AM
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 11:10:07 -0500
> From: phing <phing at videotron.ca>
> Subject: Re: [ROVERNET - UK] Getting IOE blocks properly machined
> To: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Message-ID: <004501c85923$6daa8bc0$3f558342 at userbeb5651830>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
> reply-type=response
>
> Kent
> What is a torque plate ??
> My experience LR engines , in remote areas [ eg Algeria and
> Kenya ]is that they for ever, even without rudimentary maintenance .
> They eventually consume more oil than gasoline . Swapping to a
> domestic engine might over power the transmission , The LR main high
> ratio gear box was a development of the 1939 P2 sedan box .
> Rover didn't have enough confidence in this unit to use it with the
> P5/6V8 which wasn't a high performance unit
> Cheers
> Patrick
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kent Kinard" <kentkinard at verizon.net>
> To: <rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com>
> Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 10:25 AM
> Subject: [ROVERNET - UK] Getting IOE blocks properly machined
>
>
>> Hi Linus,
>> About rebuilds. My old machinist in San Antonio has rebuilt
>> several Land Rover IOE's. We had a conversation several years ago
>> about the lack of IOE style torque plates in the US. He felt that
>> they were no longer as important for the rebuild of these
>> engines because modern machining methods use the crankshaft
>> centerline as the data point. I am still of the opinion that the
>> availability of an IOE style torque plate is important to an IOE
>> rebuild. If, at some point, a rebore and new pistons do become
>> necessary, you may want to explore these issues. Most of us
>> saloon owners are happy if our IOE's don't have a death rattle.
>> Land Rover owners faced with the necessity of reliable performance
>> in the middle of nowhere have to take these issues much more
>> seriously. Cost of IOE rebuilds is very high and many LR owners
>> in the US would rather swap to a domestic engine than do a
>> rebuild.
>>
>>
>> Roverly,
>> Kent K.
>>
>>
>> Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton wrote:
>>> Linus
>>>
>>> I have a feeling that most IOE rebuilds in recent memory have owed
>>> more to home gargae ingenuity than paid workmen. at least on this
>>> side
>>> of the water
>>>
>>> I would talk to West Coast British in Livermore; they will at least
>>> recognise the engine for what it is which is more than most
>>> places can
>>> say.
>>>
>>> http://www.offroadexperience.com/wcb/index.html
>>>
>>> Aidrian
>>>
>>>
>>>> Do any of you have suggestions for a person experienced with
>>>> this type of engine? Hopefully in California somewhere? It is
>>>> currently at the land rover engine rebulider, but he has never
>>>> done one and is taking forever just to tell us what we need to
>>>> buy. Its been there at least six months without having even been
>>>> dismantled.
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> rovernet mailing list
>>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and
>>> follow instructions:
>>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>>> Back-up list and photos at:
>>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> rovernet mailing list
>> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, look near the bottom and
>> follow instructions:
>> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
>> Back-up list and photos at:
>> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
>>
>>
>> --
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database:
>> 269.19.6/1229 - Release Date: 1/17/2008 11:12 AM
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> rovernet mailing list
> rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> To unsubscribe, go to this web page, scroll to the bottom, and
> follow instructions:
> http://mailman.nipltd.com/mailman/listinfo/rovernet
> Back-up list and photos at:
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Rover_net/
> Would digest users please change the subject and show which topic
> to which you are referring. The archive can't work properly
> without your help. Thanks.
>
> End of rovernet Digest, Vol 63, Issue 6
> ***************************************
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