R: [ROVERNET - UK] Old Rovers market in Italy

Ruotolo Gianluca (DD) gianluca.ruotolo at enel.it
Fri May 19 15:08:14 BST 2006


Hi netters,

I've read your interesting mails about old cars market and I do have smthng more to tell you about.

Old cars market in Italy is not very up nowadays, and people here prefer to buy old Alfas ( I also have one) old Lancia, old Fiat ( especially coupè). 
Also german cars are looked for, and between the english ( they don't understand) especially Jaguars.

Rolls and american cars are very rare.

Now, let' s speak about rovers market and about some cases I directly know.
P5 are rare and are becoming rarer, so it is difficult to see one, and more and more to find one.
Four years ago I found a black saloon in Torvaianica,nearby rome.
It was for sale after the man who had found it in a garage wanted to dismantle it to restore it completely, but he did not manage to do it.
That car was still working ( before the " reparation" ) and was in average conditions, so in other hands it would have been an easy project.
I know a white p5 in Udine, belonging to a medicine doctor, in very good conditioons and and another white one belonging to a friend of the registro italiano rover, who has also a P6.
By the way, this man is now looking for a Princess, which by us is difficult to find, so please let me know.

Prices of good P5 are quite high, for a very good one they could ask you 10.000 euro or more, an average one could be cheaper and a bad one very cheap.


On the other hand, as you know p6 was a grat success all over the world and had a great great success also in italy.
Now, by us, it is difficult to see one but you can still find some cars for sale, on e-bay especially or on Ruoteclassiche or La Manovalla, which are our classic cars and Classic and sports.
In my opinion, the enormous P6 success ( as you know approx. 330.000 were built) was a problem fot its short- time evaluation as a vintage car.

If you think only 85.000 jag xj6 werw built, and their price is nowadays more or less double in spite of the problems these cars suffer, you can understand what I mean.


 As I said , by us is not difficult to find a P6 for sale, but is very difficult to find a good one.
In my opinion one- owner, low - mileage car are nowadays quite rare.
A friend of the registro find a series II one, belonging to the director of a Casinò, which had covered more or less 75.000 km, but, after a long rest, the car was not so good and the engine broke down, so he had to change the pistons and others pieces. 
So, at the hand he spent more or less 5000 euro alltoghether.

Another friend in Udine bought a yellow one, rust free, good engine, average leather interior, 200.000 km covered.
I know the former owner and he got a bargain, he had the car since 1984.
The new owner payed it more or less 1500 euros and that car is very good, it only needs a new steering box.

In this cases there is a big difference between the cars market offers you.
You must be expert and lucky or you'll buy a real lemon.
When I bought mine, in 2000, there was a dark green one for sale in tuscany for about 10 millions of lire ( which is 5000 euro) but I thought it were too much.
If I had bought it, I would have saved money.

Apart from these cases, gereal problems are: 

1. prices ( they are down nowadays for a lot of old cars, also due to Euro economical crisis, and rovers are not preferred ones) ;

2. conditions ( as I told you good cars are well priced, for a good p6 you could ask also 5000 - 7000 euro ). Of course you can ask, then yoou have to sell it.

3. craftsmen. In italy, nowadays, it is difficult to find a good craftman, so, if you have to repaint a car it is very difficult. 
They only want to work on new cars they can repair work rapidly and ask money for, because working on old cars you don't earn enough.

For example, to repaint completely a p6, they could tell you they need from 75 - 80 hours up to 100, or also ( which is in my opinion a theft) 200 hours.
If you need 100 hours, if you pay 25 euro a hour at the end it's 2500 euro.
Then, if you need 5 kg of paint which could aldo be 100 euro a kg, it's 500 only for the paint.
Then you have to pay the oven, and at the end you'll have to pay more or less 3000 euro.

And they could also ask you double.
At the end, they don't want to repair old cars.

If Ruoteclassiche evaluation for a P6 is 3000 euro ( 3500 for a v8) you understand everything.

Now, have a look at these rusty rats on e-bay, and tell me how many hours you need to repair them.
And wich could be their economic value?

vendo rover 2000 TC DA RESTAUREARE Numero oggetto: 4634931890

ROVER 2000 TC ANNO 1976 Numero oggetto: 4633073153
This second one looks good, but it loses gasoline and bonnets open with difficult due to rust. I can' t imagine what you'll find taking away the wings.

http://www.novautosoncini.it/occasioniCat.asp?c=Vetture+d%27Epoca
Hasve a look here and click rover, you'll find a p6 tobacco leaf, probably seized, who has been sitting for years, for a high price.

Nowadays,by us, you must find a good and well mantained one; you don't have problems if you are able to do some works on your own, so you must became an expert!

This is also what I read on P6 drivers club site: chose the best p6 you can afford or buy, or you'll have to spend a lot of money!!


These are the problems of restoring our beloved old cars in Italy.

I'm not the first who says this, but if it's easy to find one, could be quite difficult to find a good one.


Best regards, Gianluca.


-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com [mailto:rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com] Per conto di Rod Blair
Inviato: venerdì 19 maggio 2006 11.27
A: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
Oggetto: RE: [ROVERNET - UK] So why is it so hard to find a Rover in the U S?


Hi Rovernetters
I've read with interest all the postings regarding the
dearth of Rovers in the US. 
Fortunately, the opposite exists here in Australia. It
is very hard to find buyers for "real" Rovers ~ P2,
P3, P4, P5, P6. Even if they are "project" cars, a
20ft container load, including a sound car and enough
spares to virtually build another car can be sent to
the US for $2500 - $3000 AU. I assume that similar
situations exist elsewhere. 
The worldwide demand for steel is causing many
otherwise restoreable cars to be sent to the wreckers
for their scrap value. On a regular basis, I am
offered Rovers by people who know I'm an enthusiast
and who have no further use for the cars and as I'm
the Editor of the P4 Drivers Guild of Australia
magazine, I'm  asked to advertise these for sale,
usually without a successful sale being completed. 
As  examples, I have been trying to find a buyer for a
rare model ~ a 1947 P2 12 HP saloon (when was the last
time you saw one of these??) which is complete
(partially dismantled) and in need of restoration . No
one is interested even though the price is around
$US500 and it could probably be had for much less. Two
Cyclops for the same amount for both ~ one of them a
square instrument model!!! 
Down at the heel but eminently restoreable P5s and P6s
 struggle to find new owners due in the main I think 
to the relatively small population in Australia. If
they are sold, they "go" for a pittance. 
Of course, the better examples usually manage to
attract a buyer, especially if they are useable from
day 1.
The market for old cars is supposedly a cyclical thing
~ perhaps here in Australia we are at the bottom of
the cycle. Let's hope so anyway. 

Rod Blair
Cyclops X 7
1954 90 X 2
1963 110
1962 P5 3 litre
1972 P5B Saloon
1973 P6 B

 

 
--- Paul Smith <Paul.Smith at auroraenergy.com.au> wrote:

> You've hit the nail Ali.
> Alvin has All the SD1s, Kent has the rest.
> 
> PVS
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com
> [mailto:rovernet-bounces at lyris.ccdata.com]On Behalf Of Ali Al-Abbasi
> Sent: Friday, 19 May 2006 9:06 am
> To: rovernet at lyris.ccdata.com
> Subject: [ROVERNET - UK] So why is it so hard to
> find a Rover in the US?
> 
> 
> Apart from Kent having them all?
> 
> _______________________________________________
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